Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby pvyParts » 2014-Apr-Tue-22-Apr

killbox wrote:pvyParts i'm a little bit ahead of you check out thing:287762. pretty much the same design (great minds like alike eh?) i'm still designing it and i have yet to test it (waiting on parts for the printer) and I am hoping to continue the side piece up the side of the printer to bolt back into the wooden frame (work in progress) and adding longer more stable (dampeners built in maybe) to the front. but seeing as I want to try and keep it (close-ish) to the basic 4x4 print size or the XL bed size so it can be printed easily, i had to limit the front a bit

i like the over all design of the reprap squad. But I have a 3D printer. why buy more bits when I can print stuff.


at first glance it is a bit over the 4" bed 114mm ? or is my program having a fit. do you have a thread for it? as to not OT this one?

either way very nice i'll have a play.

Aaron
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby EddB » 2014-Apr-Tue-23-Apr

pvyParts wrote:
( also i drew this at work without the printer next to me so it may be a bit wrong )


Aaron.

Looks like I am not the only one with this idea. Since mine is mounted on a board (usually) I've added captive nuts the tighten from below. So far it is extremely secure. The reason I am going this way is because anything over 150mm on the Y axis tendes to lean down. My new borosilicate glasa is almost 9" and my heat bed is as well. I want to use it all and the bearing spacing will make it more secure in the X axis as well.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Wed-07-Apr

Well it looks like the X bed modifications have gained a little too much traction for this thread. If you would like to continue discussion on increasing the X bed depth, please visit "Simple X Bed Depth Increase" thread. Here is a link:

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=6860
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby killbox » 2014-Apr-Fri-13-Apr

is anyone having issues with the belt almost coming on the bearing? my belt keeps coming oh so close to popping off when the hotend goes all the way in. and when it pulls out the belt crawls back onto the bearing.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Fri-14-Apr

killbox wrote:is anyone having issues with the belt almost coming on the bearing? my belt keeps coming oh so close to popping off when the hotend goes all the way in. and when it pulls out the belt crawls back onto the bearing.

Sounds like the belt end attached to the hot end is a little too far out. Can you shim the bearing out a hair?

The reason you only see this when retracting is the belt being fed into the bearing is out of alignment. This cause the belt to walk to that point further away from the motor plate. When extending, the belt being fed into the bearing is coming off the pulley right next to the bearing and therefore perfectly aligned and it goes back to where it should be.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Fri-14-Apr

killbox wrote:is anyone having issues with the belt almost coming on the bearing? my belt keeps coming oh so close to popping off when the hotend goes all the way in. and when it pulls out the belt crawls back onto the bearing.


Yeah, mine does that. I put some washers behind the bearing and it works well now.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Fri-17-Apr

What about anchoring points along the base and simply applying all the mods to the new wider base? In this case you could even switch between small and large. I could draw it but not CAD if anyone is interested. I was thinking of doing this any way with the LG S'S bearing you see in the link. I mean since we are going big.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s_ ... earing+8mm
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Fri-17-Apr

At this point you could even add more boards lights and whistles!
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Fri-20-Apr

I just want to add that today I replaced the small Wantai Y axis motor for a larger Kysan and the Simple is now running a lot smoother and quieter than before. I can't believe I waited this long to do this.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Fri-20-Apr

ThereWillBprints wrote:What about anchoring points along the base and simply applying all the mods to the new wider base? In this case you could even switch between small and large. I could draw it but not CAD if anyone is interested. I was thinking of doing this any way with the LG S'S bearing you see in the link. I mean since we are going big.

I am always interested in other peoples concepts and ideas. Never be ashamed to hand sketch an idea. I do my best design concepts with pencil and paper. Old school isn't just old, it is tired, true, and has stood the test of time.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Fri-22-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:I just want to add that today I replaced the small Wantai Y axis motor for a larger Kysan and the Simple is now running a lot smoother and quieter than before. I can't believe I waited this long to do this.


I really want to do this. Any pictures? I assume you'll have to put the printrboard somewhere else, but I think it would be worth it as the small wantai motor is pretty weak and runs scorching hot, or skips steps.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Fri-23-Apr

Yes you'll have to move the board somewhere else. I removed the board and put it on the outside of the wall a month ago because I didn't like the clutter and the way my cable bundle going to the extruder was bending. I'll post pics tomorrow.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby EddB » 2014-Apr-Sat-01-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:Yes you'll have to move the board somewhere else. I removed the board and put it on the outside of the wall a month ago because I didn't like the clutter and the way my cable bundle going to the extruder was bending. I'll post pics tomorrow.


It's a real mess when adding the heated bed, thermistor and autobed level sensor. Doing my current mod I couldn't figure out why my bed was not going back the last 10mm. The cable extender for the Y motor was stuck between the arm and the z-y plate. It's not if a wire is going to get jammed, it's when and how bad!
If you have the volume upgrade, the logical choice is outside the left wall. Help counteracts the extreme weight of the left side and very little cable changes. If you add an ssr or play with a extruder-board, it'a got plenty of mounting room.
I'd like to see how you mounted it as well.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-13-Apr

Excuse the mess. I'm going to wait for my long extension cables to arrive and switch over to the RAMPS 1.4 board. I'm going to place that and the raspberry pi inside the PC tower with the psu.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby EddB » 2014-Apr-Sun-02-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:Excuse the mess. I'm going to wait for my long extension cables to arrive and switch over to the RAMPS 1.4 board. I'm going to place that and the raspberry pi inside the PC tower with the psu.


Still neater than my desk!!! It looks so weird with all that open space. I bought a motor shaft coupler for my z axis threaded rod, but with all the wirea I have added, there is barely room for the original rubber shaft with zip ties.
What's the small circuit board on the top outside? Looks like a USB - B connector and maybe a relay?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sun-09-Apr

I pulled that from the PC case and put it there to power my gopro camera and the raspberry pi. I'll clean that up later on too. Right now I'm just trying to repurpose whatever I can
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Sun-17-Apr

Jon, w.r.t. the 300mm no-sag Y mod, if you have the parametric CAD version still handy... I have one rod 3" longer (instead of 2" longer) than the other, and so wanted to extend the "rear Y" bottom rod opening out an inch further, giving the piece an overall "L" shape (and potentially making a spot to hang a counterweight for experiments). Is that something you can easily generate?

If not, no worries, I'm trying to edit it using SketchUpPro, it's just that by then extending the internal opening and end appears to be a lot more work (heck, even just getting the internal opening and end selected is a lot of work), so figured I'd ask if you still had it in a parametric / pre-triangulated/polygonated form.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Mon-00-Apr

So tonight I did my Z axis install! I need extended cables for Y motor and the end stop. However, with 406mm rods my print height is now 2 1/2 times larger!

I now however am stuck with the decision if I want to go 6" for the X axis or the y axis? I have the an extra set of rods so the only one other axis gets the honor of going 10.75" as well. I will probably do make the X axis my weapon of choice as it lends itself to stability issues.

Wish me luck!
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406mm by 8mm lm rods for x and z axis
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bearing plates printed for fabricated plexi glass print bed (8"×18")
New print are a 274 mm width × 267mm height × 101 depth (will change to 200 mm once verified and I have time)
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Mon-08-Apr

jwiede wrote:Jon, w.r.t. the 300mm no-sag Y mod, if you have the parametric CAD version still handy... I have one rod 3" longer (instead of 2" longer) than the other, and so wanted to extend the "rear Y" bottom rod opening out an inch further, giving the piece an overall "L" shape (and potentially making a spot to hang a counterweight for experiments). Is that something you can easily generate?

If not, no worries, I'm trying to edit it using SketchUpPro, it's just that by then extending the internal opening and end appears to be a lot more work (heck, even just getting the internal opening and end selected is a lot of work), so figured I'd ask if you still had it in a parametric / pre-triangulated/polygonated form.

I just sketched this up as a working model to eliminate the ability of the rods to twist inside the end blocks, thus eliminating the twisting of the rods. Just finished drawing it before checking this morning so I have not printed or tested it yet.
It should work for you.

The lower pocket has an end cap to stop the rod from going all the way thru.
The bolts shown are M3x16

ExtendYRearClamp.STL

ExtendYRearClamp.JPG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Mon-09-Apr

Many thanks, Jon, this'll be a real help!

Are you planning to redo the frontY piece with similar "open" rod-sleeving + screws to hold at bottom? My printed version turned out with the proportions near perfect in everything except the holes for the rods come in at ~7.5mm and my rods are precisely 8mm. I'm debating whether to reprint slightly larger, or maybe try drilling it out slightly, but if you're going to re-release frontY part with "open sleeves" and screws like rearY shown, I'll definitely wait and reprint.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Mon-09-Apr

jwiede wrote:Many thanks, Jon, this'll be a real help!

Are you planning to redo the frontY piece with similar "open" rod-sleeving + screws to hold at bottom? My printed version turned out with the proportions near perfect in everything except the holes for the rods come in at ~7.5mm and my rods are precisely 8mm. I'm debating whether to reprint slightly larger, or maybe try drilling it out slightly, but if you're going to re-release frontY part with "open sleeves" and screws like rearY shown, I'll definitely wait and reprint.

I may be able to add one to the lower rod at the end of the rod, but there just isn't space on the upper rod. Let's see how the day goes, if I have time I will take a look at the front mount.

As for your existing part, I would simply drill it out with a 5/16" bit. This way if you have a little wobble the hole will end up at 8mm. Alternately you can always start it with the 5/16" and then use the 8mm (if you have one) as a reamer to just clean it up.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Mon-13-Apr

Thanks for the continuing updates John!

Also for the guys who did the Z axis extension, where did you get the cables to extend the y motor+endstop cables? Even without them I have an extra inch now on the z axis but I want to go all the way!
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406mm by 8mm lm rods for x and z axis
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New print are a 274 mm width × 267mm height × 101 depth (will change to 200 mm once verified and I have time)
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Mon-13-Apr

ThereWillBprints wrote:So tonight I did my Z axis install! I need extended cables for Y motor and the end stop. However, with 406mm rods my print height is now 2 1/2 times larger!

I now however am stuck with the decision if I want to go 6" for the X axis or the y axis? I have the an extra set of rods so the only one other axis gets the honor of going 10.75" as well. I will probably do make the X axis my weapon of choice as it lends itself to stability issues.

Wish me luck!


I've been looking for a place to get a longer acme rod. Where did you get yours? Mcmaster has a 3 foot length and its a tad bit pricy since i only can utilize about 1.5feet.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Mon-14-Apr

Amazon has rods in lengths of 330, 406, and ~490 (can't recall the last measurement). Do search on "8mm rod 406" and you'll find them, the listings start with "Linear motion".
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Mon-14-Apr

jwiede wrote:Amazon has rods in lengths of 330, 406, and ~490 (can't recall the last measurement). Do search on "8mm rod 406" and you'll find them, the listings start with "Linear motion".

I believe he was asking about the threaded ACME screw. But in the case the question was about linear rail, the Amazon linear rod is made by VXB. If you go to VXB direct, the pricing is much better. Slow shipping is about $6 per order, not per piece. Double check the shipping isn't strange, but below is the same part from Amazon and XVB along with the shipping estimate for me:

Amazon Linear Rail.PNG

VXB Linear Rail.PNG

VXB Shipping.PNG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Mon-15-Apr

I bought my linear smooth rods from ebay. Turns out they came from vxb.

Still looking for the 1/4"-16 acme rod.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby greenb » 2014-Apr-Mon-15-Apr

Some Printr Noob wrote:
I bought my linear smooth rods from ebay. Turns out they came from vxb.

Still looking for the 1/4"-16 acme rod.


Here you go
http://www.mcmaster.com/#acme-threaded-studs/=rjcc82
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Mon-15-Apr

I bought my rods from vxb directly and couldn't be happier from the results. My new print area with only two sets of rods should be 8×6×8 and heated! However I have no plans to go to ABS plastic.

Also I am thinking of just printing an extension plate for my board as to for go the wire extensions.

As I see it the print area works out perfect for this and it seems the cables from the lower motors and end stops will cover the remaining space. Also I will print support feet for the sides of the base to allow for all the new weight.

I really am enjoying seeing the different styles though!
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New print are a 274 mm width × 267mm height × 101 depth (will change to 200 mm once verified and I have time)
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Mon-18-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:Excuse the mess. I'm going to wait for my long extension cables to arrive and switch over to the RAMPS 1.4 board. I'm going to place that and the raspberry pi inside the PC tower with the psu.
Image
Image
Image


What part is that on top of all three rods? I need that!

@John I will use my Note 3 to draw out the anchoring points as well as the new base I was thinking of, I am sorry I did not see that post earlier ;)
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406mm by 8mm lm rods for x and z axis
Z stabilizer bar
bearing plates printed for fabricated plexi glass print bed (8"×18")
New print are a 274 mm width × 267mm height × 101 depth (will change to 200 mm once verified and I have time)
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Mon-22-Apr

ThereWillBprints: I think you meant to say that to Jon (no "h") L., or am I misunderstanding?

Jon: As I forgot and printed the rearY piece at 60% instead of 100% infill, attempting to drill it with 5/16th kinda made a mess of it. The new screw-based design should solve any sizing issues nicely, so I'll just print up one of those as "rearY". I printed the "frontY" piece at 100% infill, so I'm hoping drilling it with the 5/16th goes better. Will edit shortly with outcome, maybe pics. Thanks as always for the info/help!

(edit) Actually, even the rearY piece might still be okay. Drilling out the frontY piece worked wonders at allowing the bottom rod to seat properly, but ran out of time before I could try drilling the shallower top rod's seating, guess I'll try that tomorrow.

On a separate note, how common is it for the front/rear pieces to twist out of "flatness" once under tension? Seems like that might be an issue, figured I'd ask.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Tue-14-Apr

Thanks for the correction;)

Alas I got my threaded rod from Lowe's and it proved to be a stupid move, of course, since the threads were 20 not 16 and not even the reprap calculator could get me back to the proper steps. Every time I tried to hit 50mm it would go some where else. Than I found out that it pretty much destroyed the coupling between the motor and rod causing massive slippage and wobble. I have a spare but need to order the rod.

With that said I think I will order the m8 rod and the 1/4" 20 rod as well. The M8 rod is supposed to give you more accuracy but with the 1/4" you don't have to do calibration. Oh nerd woes....
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406mm by 8mm lm rods for x and z axis
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New print are a 274 mm width × 267mm height × 101 depth (will change to 200 mm once verified and I have time)
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Tue-15-Apr

ThereWillBprints wrote:Thanks for the correction;)

Alas I got my threaded rod from Lowe's and it proved to be a stupid move, of course, since the threads were 20 not 16 and not even the reprap calculator could get me back to the proper steps. Every time I tried to hit 50mm it would go some where else. Than I found out that it pretty much destroyed the coupling between the motor and rod causing massive slippage and wobble. I have a spare but need to order the rod.

With that said I think I will order the m8 rod and the 1/4" 20 rod as well. The M8 rod is supposed to give you more accuracy but with the 1/4" you don't have to do calibration. Oh nerd woes....

Not much calibration needed as the rod threads are well defined. The only trick is finding out what thread you actually have.
Here is a posting that shows the steps / mm for various threads. You would simply enter the number under the "microsteps/mm" column for your thread as your "calibration". Should come out spot on.
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=6179&p=40297#p40300
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Tue-16-Apr

Thanks again Jon, the calculator gave the same number so I am going to believe that either I am entering it in wrong manually or that the coupler, stock, couldn't handle the connection. After spending the better part of sleeping I found out it was the coupler. I am going to replace with a brand new one and see what happens. If nothing I am guessing I could print it on the old stock rod.

By the by, I entered the following code in Repetier control panel on my mac:

M92 Z2519.69
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby RetireeJay » 2014-Apr-Tue-17-Apr

ThereWillBprints wrote:By the by, I entered the following code in Repetier control panel on my mac:

M92 Z2519.69


That lasts until you turn off the power. Use M500 after sending the calibration factor to store it in EEPROM. viewtopic.php?f=18&t=2763
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Wed-12-Apr

Question for those using the front end with the mount for the aluminum extruder "ExtendYFront2014AlExtruder"

Would this part benefit from a couple gussets to help support under the aluminum extruder?

ExtendY2014Gusset.JPG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Wed-13-Apr

I think it's fine the way it is. It'll probably get in the way of the wirings anyway.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby killbox » 2014-Apr-Wed-13-Apr

looks better to me. I have a problem with your current design. I have the mod installed and it's stabilized now but before i learned how hot my extruder motor ran, the front end soften enough distort. it's not a print ending failure but i think it could due with some reinforcement
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Wed-19-Apr

killbox wrote:looks better to me. I have a problem with your current design. I have the mod installed and it's stabilized now but before i learned how hot my extruder motor ran, the front end soften enough distort. it's not a print ending failure but i think it could due with some reinforcement


I've done 12 hour prints just fine. Tweak your extruder motor's pot settings so that it only gets the current it needs; no more and no less.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby killbox » 2014-Apr-Wed-20-Apr

I did that, also added a high speed fan and a heatsink. but I'd still like the extra support
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Thu-12-Apr

Uploaded a version RevA to Thingiverse that includes some extra supports for anybody interested. All versions are still available for download, so use whatever works best for your situation.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Thu-16-Apr

Jon,Is there a way of squeezing in a hole between the rods and the extruder motor for an aftermarket probe to fit in(larger probe)I'll get measurements
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Thu-17-Apr

Munson wrote:Jon,Is there a way of squeezing in a hole between the rods and the extruder motor for an aftermarket probe to fit in(larger probe)I'll get measurements

All things are possible. Post more info when you have a chance.
Anybody have info / dimensions on the Printrbot version auto-level sensor?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Palerob » 2014-Apr-Thu-19-Apr

Jon Lawrence wrote:
Munson wrote:Jon,Is there a way of squeezing in a hole between the rods and the extruder motor for an aftermarket probe to fit in(larger probe)I'll get measurements

All things are possible. Post more info when you have a chance.
Anybody have info / dimensions on the Printrbot version auto-level sensor?


Jon,
First a big thank you for all the mods! I believe you can find the information that you are looking for in the following thread, viewtopic.php?f=113&t=6812 . It has both information on the PrintrBot sensor and an alternative that is being looked at by Mr. Hawkins.

Also since this is my first post, thank you to everyone on the forum for the great information and support!

Thanks
Rob
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Some Printr Noob » 2014-Apr-Fri-20-Apr

Currently pondering a bowden setup with this mod. I did see this part:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:292716

But the 2-3mm hotend raise will likely cause some problems with my Z extension hitting my aluminum coupler(I have <1mm spacing when homed).
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:300647

My current solidworks skills are super nooby still, so I was wondering if someone could remix and put the bowden addon directly into the extruder plate, so that it wouldn't raise the hotend 3mm.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Fri-21-Apr

I can make a different adapter that would keep the hotend at the same height.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Tue-12-Apr

Palerob wrote:
Jon Lawrence wrote:
Munson wrote:Jon,Is there a way of squeezing in a hole between the rods and the extruder motor for an aftermarket probe to fit in(larger probe)I'll get measurements

All things are possible. Post more info when you have a chance.
Anybody have info / dimensions on the Printrbot version auto-level sensor?


Jon,
First a big thank you for all the mods! I believe you can find the information that you are looking for in the following thread, viewtopic.php?f=113&t=6812 . It has both information on the PrintrBot sensor and an alternative that is being looked at by Mr. Hawkins


I feel guilty asking for more changes, but I too would be very interested in a version derived from ExtendYFront2014AlExtruder that has extra "deck" and mounting hole for the Printrbot sensor. Where do you think you'd locate the sensor in that design?

Seems like there's a lot of "stuff" in the fan duct in the current design, so I was thinking of moving the belt end elsewhere to avoid clogging the fan duct so much. Putting the belt end down in the fan duct has it rather "low" compared to the other end -- there'd be a rather significant upslope on the belt towards the rear during Y homing/retraction. Was the slope of the belt done to help somehow with the problem of it walking off the bearing? Or the end just moved there for space reasons?

Thanks much for all the work on these mod designs!!
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-13-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398192012.286004.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-13-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398192055.584424.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-13-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398192096.033908.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-13-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398192150.167407.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-13-Apr

Those are the measurements for the aftermarket sensor probe.Sorry for the delay I was in the hospital
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Tue-15-Apr

Munson wrote:Those are the measurements for the aftermarket sensor probe.Sorry for the delay I was in the hospital

First and foremost, I hope your are well and it was nothing serious.

Here is a quick version. No room anywhere but out in front. :(
The sensor is offset: X=35mm, Y=30mm

ExtendYFront2014AlExtruderRevB.STL

AutoLevelSensor.JPG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-17-Apr

Thanks,That was fast...I agree with it.Does anyone else in here have any input?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Tue-18-Apr

Munson is that the actual part sold through Printrbot or something with similar geometries?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-19-Apr

Not from printrbot,I may be wrong but it looks like the printrbot probe is narrower,My thinking was if the hole is large enough to fit the one from amazon most are using,a washer could be used to narrow the hole for printr
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-19-Apr

Printrbot probe.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Palerob » 2014-Apr-Tue-19-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:Munson is that the actual part sold through Printrbot or something with similar geometries?


Evan,
That looks like one of the sensors Mr. Hawkins was mentioning/testing, Amazon or E-Bay $5. See this thread, viewtopic.php?f=113&t=6812&p=44629#p44120.

Hope that helps.

Thanks
Rob
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Tue-19-Apr

Yes it is
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby pvyParts » 2014-Apr-Tue-19-Apr

seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

sorry i don't have my drawing stuff here today so just a printout with some ink on it lol!

no y offset
with a bit of -x

Image


i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

** edit ** i realise that this wont print as is was just getting my idea on paper
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Tue-20-Apr

pvyParts wrote:seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

no y offset
with a bit of -x

i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

I started looking at that side, but need some feedback from those with the XL upgrade. I think there is a wall in the way somewhere in there when completely retracted.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby pvyParts » 2014-Apr-Tue-20-Apr

Jon Lawrence wrote:
pvyParts wrote:seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

no y offset
with a bit of -x

i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

I started looking at that side, but need some feedback from those with the XL upgrade. I think there is a wall in the way somewhere in there when completely retracted.


i have the xl upgrade so i cant use the cable carrage as it hits the top i'll take some photos tonight when i get home. i'm waiting on my rods to install the y mod but you will get the idea. non the less.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby EddB » 2014-Apr-Wed-02-Apr

Jon Lawrence wrote:
pvyParts wrote:seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

no y offset
with a bit of -x

i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

I started looking at that side, but need some feedback from those with the XL upgrade. I think there is a wall in the way somewhere in there when completely retracted.


I can verify that your cable manager just kisses it! I only plan to use this part that mounts on the carriage, so I am going to trim it rather than waste it. It's tricky placing the probe since you do not want to post it up against the magnetic coils of the fans or the heater. (induction sensor read magnetic flux). Or place metal near the head that is closer than the bed you are trying to read.
1398239478359.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby pvyParts » 2014-Apr-Wed-04-Apr

EddB wrote:
Jon Lawrence wrote:
pvyParts wrote:seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

no y offset
with a bit of -x

i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

I started looking at that side, but need some feedback from those with the XL upgrade. I think there is a wall in the way somewhere in there when completely retracted.


I can verify that your cable manager just kisses it! I only plan to use this part that mounts on the carriage, so I am going to trim it rather than waste it. It's tricky placing the probe since you do not want to post it up against the magnetic coils of the fans or the heater. (induction sensor read magnetic flux). Or place metal near the head that is closer than the bed you are trying to read.


also with the chain carrage thingo, when you rise to the top it hits the spool holder.

it is not on there but you get the idea i need longer poles before i mount all the new parts i have sitting here in a box xD

if you need some measurements let us know i am sure we can get them :)

DSC04605.JPG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Wed-13-Apr

Jon Lawrence wrote:
pvyParts wrote:seeing as i already had the printed parts for the y mod i was thinking of something like this to bolt on for the auto leveler

no y offset
with a bit of -x

i was gonna just cable tie it to the pole hence the dodgy circles

I started looking at that side, but need some feedback from those with the XL upgrade. I think there is a wall in the way somewhere in there when completely retracted.


Ayup, I'm pretty sure putting it to the -X side of the hotend is a no-go for XL folks, it would definitely be a problem in my setup due to the "wall" you mention.

Jon, I'm attaching the pix/measurements I made of the "Printrbot" sensor (the one I received from Printrbot, in mm, rightmost 2 are hundreths):
sensor0.jpg
sensor1.jpg
sensor2.jpg
sensor3.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Wed-14-Apr

jwiede wrote:Jon, I'm attaching the pix/measurements I made of the "Printrbot" sensor (the one I received from Printrbot...)


Here is a version with the 12mm Printrbot prox switch.
X: 25mm
Y: 20mm

ExtendYFront2014AlExtruderRevC.STL

AutoLevelSensor12mm.JPG
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Wed-18-Apr

Will that size the aftermarket also or just the stock sensor from printrbot?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Wed-20-Apr

Munson wrote:Will that size the aftermarket also or just the stock sensor from printrbot?

RevB for the 18mm prox "aftermarket" viewtopic.php?f=21&t=6306&start=100#p45435
RevC for the 12mm prox "Printrbot store" viewtopic.php?f=21&t=6306&start=100#p45500
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby ThereWillBprints » 2014-Apr-Thu-01-Apr

I know this is off topic slightly but I was wondering about the wiring.

Where do you buy male to female connectors for the 4 pin from the y axis motor? Also the 2 pin connector for the endstop? Did you just splice the wires and go from there? I am horrible at soldering so that is why I ask. I would even paypal someone to make a set for me if they pm me.

**edit*** The staff at PrintrBot got me the proper size threaded rod and wires. Shipping out today!***

Thanks.

On another note the new mods rock. Might I suggest spacing the motor out away from the plate by two ways? The first being a wall plate to act as a barrier and the second as a actual anchor point. Another thing to keep in mind the metal printrbot rotated the extruder by 180 all together, which leads me to believe they have high heat issues there as well.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Fri-19-Apr

How about this for the probe mount? This is the 12mm version with 0 Y offset and X = 30mm. If you want the Amazon probe version let me know. This setup shouldn't interfere with the XL tower wall, but who knows.
Bed-probe-mount-12mm.jpg
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-05-Apr

That is a perfect spot Evan!Is that an add on?what about the fan for the extruder?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Jon Lawrence » 2014-Apr-Sat-07-Apr

evanalmighty wrote:How about this for the probe mount? This is the 12mm version with 0 Y offset and X = 30mm. If you want the Amazon probe version let me know. This setup shouldn't interfere with the XL tower wall, but who knows.

Looks great. Clean and simple is always better. I do have a tendency to go for complicated for no good reason. Is there enough thread on the sensor to reach that high?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-08-Apr

I just started printing yours Jon,a 7 hour print.I hope Evans addon screws on simply and the fan can be squeezed in.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-09-Apr

I'm not sure. If it's not long enough let me know and I'll extend it down. I don't have my extruder fan located on that side. Are you wanting to integrate a fan mount with the probe holder?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-09-Apr

Where do you have your fan?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-09-Apr

It's mounted on the heatsink, which is bonded to the motor with thermal adhesive.

Image
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-10-Apr

What about the heat from the hot end rising into the extruder?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-10-Apr

I find that keeping the motor cool does more than trying to keep the hotend heat from creeping up.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-11-Apr

I'll give that a whirl,do you have the aftermarket setup yet?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-11-Apr

Or maybe I'll try placing the fan in the front and space it so it will blow on the alu and the motor
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-11-Apr

Aftermarket setup? What's that?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-11-Apr

The 18 mm hole,the probe that is sold on amazon is a bit larger.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-13-Apr

Oh ok i'll post that up in a bit.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-14-Apr

So here's the 18mm aftermarket probe mount version. If you want to incorporate the fan mount with it let me know. I'll think of something.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-15-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398544421.258937.jpg
the only thing that may cause an issue to mount it is the support piece underneath.I will try to stuff some washers in there,the print has already started..thank you Evan
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-16-Apr

Ah I did not have that new reinforced version of the extruder mount so I missed that brace right there.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-16-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398550302.881989.jpg
it is a very tight fit,without the right size screws it is very hard to mount.Thanks for the effort Evan.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-17-Apr

Can you measure how tall/deep that brace is? I can make some quick spacers to clear that.

Here's a 6mm tall spacer, but I'm guessing you don't need that much.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-17-Apr

A 4.5mm spacer will work with a m3x22 screw with a little wiggly room
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-17-Apr

Keep the 6,I just miked the brace
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-17-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398552742.687030.jpg
I purchased this along with a piece of sheet aluminum 12x12 for 8 bucks and a pine board 24x12 I had cut to size for 1.50 at Home Depot for a bed.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-17-Apr

The 6 was too long,3 would only work if I dremel out a piece of the brace,If you make the spacers any longer I fear that there will be too little thread going into the alu,in my case a plastic extruder
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-18-Apr

So you think 4.5mm will work best?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sat-19-Apr

4.5 will require longer screws,personally I have no issue cutting a small piece of structure.I have so many m3x22 and other assorted fasteners from the y axis I am Trying to incorporate instead of purchasing another box of 50 for only 2 that will be used.that is why I suggested 3mm,others may not have a dremel.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sat-20-Apr

Here's a 3mm spacer version. Hope that helps.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby EddB » 2014-Apr-Sat-21-Apr

Munson wrote:
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398552742.687030.jpg
I purchased this along with a piece of sheet aluminum 12x12 for 8 bucks and a pine board 24x12 I had cut to size for 1.50 at Home Depot for a bed.


Keep in mind that a great way to remove that type of adhesive is to use heat. If you are printing directly to it, it may start to break down.
I have some rolls of sheet copper that I was thinking to apply under my glass bed with Kapton tape. If the sensor signal is not strong enough, I can always place the copper on my bed for the leveling sequence. If it is the same spots each time, then I could even use the kapton tape a cut out medallions of copper for those leveling spots.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby jwiede » 2014-Apr-Sun-14-Apr

Munson wrote:I purchased this along with a piece of sheet aluminum 12x12 for 8 bucks and a pine board 24x12 I had cut to size for 1.50 at Home Depot for a bed.

That adhesive isn't really suitable for high-temp. usage, it'll break down when heated, and when heated fumes could become an issue.

Also, if you haven't printed on alum. before, its innate heat-sink effect can lead to peel-up/curling issues. Some folks have had luck using a hairdryer/heatgun to heat their alum. bed before printing, but if bonded with that 3M spray adhesive, such heating isn't advisable. If you encounter such problems, I find multiple layers of blue painter's tape helps insulate the print from the bed a bit, and works great as a print surface on alum. bed (wipe tape with iso alcohol after applying to bed).

Printing PLA, a bed heater at low to moderate temp. (45C-60C) will solve most peel-up/curling issues, and help with thermal stability. If you decide to add one later under that same piece of alum. bed, remember to clean any traces of that 3M spray adhesive before attempting to heat the alum. bed.
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sun-15-Apr

Thanks jwiede and eddb,maybe I can just drive small nails into the wood board where the sensor levels the points?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sun-15-Apr

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1398631815.452790.jpg
ok,has anyone else built this yet?I am having a lot of issues.First,I am losing about 2inches on my Y retract because the new frame holes seem closer together.Second,I had to order an alu because I printed a plastic version and my hot end is not only wobbly but too high up now,I bottomed out after adjusting my z axis screw a 1/4 inch and still cannot reach the bed.Last I tried to use Evans mod but it is just too high for my probe to reach the bed.My printer is up on cinder blocks for a while :(
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby evanalmighty » 2014-Apr-Sun-16-Apr

How much lower does it need to go?
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Re: Simple-300mm Y axis, No sag!

Postby Munson » 2014-Apr-Sun-17-Apr

Evan It's fine,thanks for the effort.The gap is 10-15mm off not adding in the original spacing you provided.I am still wondering if I lost 1mm on the print on the new Y from changing my settings on my z from 2020 to 2015.xx.I ordered an alu extruder,Jon Lawrence designs are always on the money it must be my settings
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