Connectors on Printrboard

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Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Jun-Thu-11-Jun

As the Printrbot web site seems to be missing a fully-labeled diagram for the connections on the Printrboard, I have provided one here:

PrintrboardConnections1600X1200.jpg
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Last edited by RetireeJay on 2013-Jun-Wed-12-Jun, edited 3 times in total.
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Connectors on Printrboard

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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby plexus » 2013-Jun-Thu-12-Jun

Just a little detail: the "unused" is actually the E-stop or E-switch header. you may need to use it for your Y if you get the firmware lock-up issue that happens sometimes on rev B-D boards. for example, me. I started getting "commands waiting" from the host (Repetier) and this indicates the firmware didn't boot. there is a bug on the board that causes this if the Y switch is not open when the board is powered up. to solve this you move the Y switch to the E-stop header and change the pins.h in the firmware and recompile. there are threads about this elsewhere.

The point is "unused" is a little misleading because you may need to use it. I would label it "E-stop (typically unused)" so people don't get confused if they read posts that talk about using it.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Jun-Thu-12-Jun

OK, done.

But don't you have to be a Jedi knight and uber-geek guru to find all the software tools, special cables, and procedures to re-flash your software? I know when I read the threads about it I just get a headache... so many steps!!! (And I've been programming computers in Assembly, BASIC, Turbo Pascal, and Visual Basic since 1966; the problem is I kinda dropped out of that field in the last 10 years.)

(And if you can do re-flashing, why not fix the bug instead of implement a work-around?)
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PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby plexus » 2013-Jun-Thu-17-Jun

RetireeJay wrote:OK, done.

But don't you have to be a Jedi knight and uber-geek guru to find all the software tools, special cables, and procedures to re-flash your software? I know when I read the threads about it I just get a headache... so many steps!!! (And I've been programming computers in Assembly, BASIC, Turbo Pascal, and Visual Basic since 1966; the problem is I kinda dropped out of that field in the last 10 years.)

(And if you can do re-flashing, why not fix the bug instead of implement a work-around?)


No. I am not a jedi knight nor uber-geek and i figured it out. i am also DEFINITELY not a software guy. but i wanted to increase the hot end temp limit and the speed limits so i needed to dig into the firmware. it took me about 3 hours total to work out all the issue and all of it has been documented in the forum. once you get it set up and get the process down, its trivial to re-flash. this is handy when you want to make a little tweek to the firmware so learning to do it doesn't limit your abilities with the printer.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby PxT » 2013-Jun-Thu-19-Jun

RetireeJay wrote:But don't you have to be a Jedi knight and uber-geek guru to find all the software tools, special cables, and procedures to re-flash your software?



Sort of… BUT I am working to make this easier, at least for Mac users (I don't have any Windows expertise, sorry). I have an app ready that will update the firmware for you with a few simple clicks. I have provided it to Brook, I am hoping that he will post it on his website (he asked me to write it). You only need the regular USB cable, and my app is self-contained - no other software needed.

If not then I will put up a link to my Dropbox here with the info sometime soon.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Jun-Sat-12-Jun

Help!
Can anyone teach me how to format the above picture (in the original post) so that you don't have to scroll to see all of it? (I'd prefer to keep it larger than a postage stamp so that it's easy for people to read. I've seen lots of pictures elsewhere in the forums that are just as big and don't need scrolling.)

Jay
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby Mochaboy » 2013-Jun-Thu-08-Jun

Not sure what's showing on your screen RJ - I see an image that's about 800px wide which is small enough to fit on the screen without scrolling, but large enough to make out the important details.. It also links to the larger image in case I need to zoom in.

Speaking as someone who just bought a printrbot JR - here's a big THANK YOU for contributing that diagram. Rest assured - you'll have a captive audience of at least 1 (and I'm sure more) for the next few weeks :)

For the motor pots - increase = clockwise/decrease = counterclockwise turn? Or is it vice versa?

Thanks!
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby Mochaboy » 2013-Jun-Thu-08-Jun

RetireeJay wrote:OK, done.

But don't you have to be a Jedi knight and uber-geek guru to find all the software tools, special cables, and procedures to re-flash your software? I know when I read the threads about it I just get a headache... so many steps!!! (And I've been programming computers in Assembly, BASIC, Turbo Pascal, and Visual Basic since 1966; the problem is I kinda dropped out of that field in the last 10 years.)

(And if you can do re-flashing, why not fix the bug instead of implement a work-around?)


If it's anything like the process for my flight controllers it's pretty straightforward.
(search "how to set up mpng" - dammit I need more posts)

The user friendly approach to setting up these controllers would be to plug in a USB cable and go, but failing that you have alternate ways to get to the chip. If we're talking about a chip with a bootloader (which 99% of them are unless you bought a blank from digikey), one option involves talking to the transmit, receive, power, ground and reset line typically through a serial converter like an FTDI cable. There's also a way to interface the chips directly through their in circuit serial programming (ICSP or just ISP for short) headers - you would see these referred to as:
MOSI - out,
MISO - in,
SCK - clock
RST - reset
PWR - 3-5v depends on the speed you run the chip
GND - gnd,

The ISP headers work a little different than the regular tx/rx line as you're interfacing directly with the chip's programming pins rather than going through the digital transmission pins...a typical setup process would be that you use the ISP headers using a tool called a USBASP to load a bootloader on to the chip. You can continue with the USBASP to upload firmware if you're familiar with the command line or you could hand over the firmware upload procedures to a GUI in which case you use a USB cable to access to the chip either directly through a USB cable or through a serial converter like an FTDI breakout board.

Sorry that went a little longer than I wanted - but I've had to develop a lot of techniques for interfacing directly with these AVR chips to effect all sorts of madness so I hope that comes in handy with this project :)
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby arin » 2013-Sep-Tue-09-Sep

Hi, @RetireeJay, thank you for the much needed labelled diagram of Printrboard. However, I have a few questions, the male connectors beside the processor and the ones beside the E-stop are for what purpose exactly? From what I can guess, the ones in the center of the board are probably for JTAG. In that case, I have one more question, can we actually connect the processor with the JTAG to the programming environment for some mods. I appreciate you taking out the time to label the diagram for us and a thank you in advance for giving time to my questions.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Sep-Tue-10-Sep

I had never heard of JTAG before, but I looked it up on Wikipedia, and it seems that you are correct. Expansion Header 1 has pins labeled with the JTAG names.
Printrboard Headers.JPG


Besides that, the headers are also used to connect daughter boards for an LCD display/controller and for expansion to two or more print heads.

You can find the schematic in PDF form in Reprap.org (wiki - Printrboard) and also in Eagle format in Github.
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby Mooselake » 2013-Sep-Tue-18-Sep

JTAG appears to be the modern equivalent of an in-circuit emulator, breakpoints, single step, and all that fun software developing stuff you can't do with an oscilloscope. Something else on my to-do list.

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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby donstauffer » 2013-Nov-Sat-10-Nov

I have a problem with the Extruder connector. There are two cables that have to be plugged in here. The connector on the board is a four pin. The two cables from the extruder are both two pin, so I believe electrically everything would fit. This is, BTW, on the "simple" kit. However, the connectors on the cables have little collars that help physically grasp the connector they are plugged into. These prevent the connectors being plugged into the connector on the board. I guess I could cut them off, but the instructions say nothing about modifying the connectors, so I am reluctant to cut them off!
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Nov-Sat-11-Nov

donstauffer wrote:I have a problem with the Extruder connector. There are two cables that have to be plugged in here. The connector on the board is a four pin. The two cables from the extruder are both two pin, so I believe electrically everything would fit. This is, BTW, on the "simple" kit. However, the connectors on the cables have little collars that help physically grasp the connector they are plugged into. These prevent the connectors being plugged into the connector on the board. I guess I could cut them off, but the instructions say nothing about modifying the connectors, so I am reluctant to cut them off!


Donstauffer, it is extremely unlikely that you really have two Extruder cables that need to be plugged in to one connector on the board.
There are two totally independent Extruder-related circuits: the Extruder Heater and the Extruder Thermistor. Note on the diagram at the top of this post that the Heater plugs into the connector on the left, and the Thermistor plugs into the connector on the right. The heater probably has red and black wires; the thermistor has white and black wires.

It would help if you could take a photograph of the connectors you are talking about. In fact, take two pictures: one where the cables you are discussing plug in to the corresponding "floating" plugs at the Extruder, and another photo of the connectors that you want to plug in to the board.
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
Have used many pounds of T-Glase filament. Now also doing some work with Ninjaflex SemiFlex
Print on glass with Scotch Craft Stick or other glue stick
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby REPRAP SQUAD » 2013-Nov-Sat-12-Nov

Here's the basic layout of connections. I hope it helps to clarify a bit. I would recommend that you take pics as RetireeJay stated because that will give him exact knowledge of the situation and RetireeJay will definitely do all he can to get you setup.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby donstauffer » 2013-Nov-Sat-17-Nov

Okay, as I grabbed the extension cables to photograph them, I came across a third extension cable I had overlooked before. This IS a four pin connector, although only two pins are wired (I do not know what the other red and black wire cable is for). This does look like it will fit that left hand connector (picture below). However, there are two cables coming from the extruder, one with two red wires, and one with smaller clear-insulated wires (see pic). If I plug the cable with the four pin connector, which will mate with the red wires from the extruder, into that left hand connector, what do I do with the cable with the smaller two wires coming out of the extruder. Not visible in any photo I could take, the two connectors are labeled (left) "extruder, and (right) hotbed. Even if I tried to plug the cable that seems to match up with the smaller wires from the extruder (are these the thermistor?), I again have the problem of a two pin connector going into the four pin connector, and the two pin connector on the extension cable would have to be hacked up to plug into the right hand four-pin connector. Whoops, how do I post an image on this board. Do I have to upload them to a third party site like Photobucket (I do have an account there) and put the URL between the [img etch bracket sets?



RetireeJay wrote:
donstauffer wrote:I have a problem with the Extruder connector. There are two cables that have to be plugged in here. The connector on the board is a four pin. The two cables from the extruder are both two pin, so I believe electrically everything would fit. This is, BTW, on the "simple" kit. However, the connectors on the cables have little collars that help physically grasp the connector they are plugged into. These prevent the connectors being plugged into the connector on the board. I guess I could cut them off, but the instructions say nothing about modifying the connectors, so I am reluctant to cut them off!


Donstauffer, it is extremely unlikely that you really have two Extruder cables that need to be plugged in to one connector on the board.
There are two totally independent Extruder-related circuits: the Extruder Heater and the Extruder Thermistor. Note on the diagram at the top of this post that the Heater plugs into the connector on the left, and the Thermistor plugs into the connector on the right. The heater probably has red and black wires; the thermistor has white and black wires.

It would help if you could take a photograph of the connectors you are talking about. In fact, take two pictures: one where the cables you are discussing plug in to the corresponding "floating" plugs at the Extruder, and another photo of the connectors that you want to plug in to the board.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Nov-Sat-17-Nov

You can post photos on this board directly. Just below the text area where you are typing your message you see a tab called "Upload attachment." Click on that tab, then click on "Browse" and select the file from a location on your computer. Click "Add the file" and then you can "Display Inline" :)
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
Have used many pounds of T-Glase filament. Now also doing some work with Ninjaflex SemiFlex
Print on glass with Scotch Craft Stick or other glue stick
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby donstauffer » 2013-Nov-Sun-13-Nov

DSC_0542.JPG
Okay, here are the pics I took for my problem with connecting up the extruder. The first one shows the extruder with the two bundles of wire with seperate connectors. I have resolved everything now for the heavy red wires, I found the cable with the four-pin connector. However, below is a picture of the extension for the smaller wires (the thermistor?)

Okay this is a two pin connector. The only connector left along that edge of the electronics board is labeled "hotbed" and it is a four pin connector. That two pin connector will not fit without chopping those ears off, and I am reluctant to connect it to a connector labeled hotbed.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby REPRAP SQUAD » 2013-Nov-Sun-13-Nov

In the 1st pic: the larger red wire bundle is for your heater cartridge and the smaller clear wrapped ones is your thermistor . The white and black wire extension in the 2nd plugs into your thermistor plug on your board which is a two pin plug.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby REPRAP SQUAD » 2013-Nov-Sun-13-Nov

If the only plug you have available is the hotbed plug them you plugged something else into your thermistor plug. It is located at the opposite end of the power plug right next to the fan plug. See diagram for proper wiring.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Nov-Sun-14-Nov

Don, you are on the right track. But that "4-pin" connector on the right side of the board is really two 2-pin connectors butted up against each other. One is labeled "T-EXT" and the other is labeled "T-BED." (You could interpret the "T" as being either "Thermistor" or "Temperature"; it doesn't matter. ;) )

Here is a picture with just the extruder thermistor plugged in. You can see both of the labels on the board in this picture.
ExtruderThermistorPluggedIn.jpg


And just in case you ever have a heated bed, here's what it looks like with both plugged in.
BedAndExtruderThermistorsPluggedIn.jpg


By the way, a "Thermistor" is a device for measuring temperature. The kind we use has two leads. Electrically it is a resistor whose resistance changes with temperature - "THERMal resISTOR." The Printrboard has to send a small current through the resistor in order to "sense" its resistance; the board has a built-in table of values to translate sensed resistance into equivalent temperature. It's very important for your Extruder because the temperature there needs to be controlled rather precisely. So it's in what's called a "feedback loop" where the board sends just the right amount of power to the heater to make the actual temperature match your desired temperature (the setpoint).

Another By the Way... the connectors at the Extruder end are set up with their "genders" opposite, so you can't plug power into the thermistor plug there and you can't plug the thermistor cable into the heater there. Just a little safety factor for you. :)
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
Have used many pounds of T-Glase filament. Now also doing some work with Ninjaflex SemiFlex
Print on glass with Scotch Craft Stick or other glue stick
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby donstauffer » 2013-Nov-Mon-10-Nov

Thanks, Jay. The thing that was throwing me is that the photos in the instructions show to plug the thermistor into the connector right next to the one the extruder power is plugged into. By "right side" I meant right side of the edge that the first connector is on. That one along the same edge, but to the right of the extruder one is the four-pin one labeled hotbed. Your pix make it clear now, the thermistor is plugged into a connector on another edge of the board, not near the extruder connector.

BTW, this highlights a question I have on the operation of the printbots. I understand the carriage movements and the stepper motors fine. But I do not understand operation of extruder. I assume the thermistor is to maintain a given temperature of the extruder, in a feedback control loop. But what starts and stops deposition of the molten plastic? I assume there is some way the system starts and stops flow, so that it does not deposit in areas that create holes or openings.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2013-Nov-Mon-11-Nov

I looked at the latest Simple instructions, and I think I see the problem: besides the heater and the thermistor, there is a third device on the extruder, which is a fan. The fan cabling is the two-conductor red & black wiring that ends in a 2-pin plug. This is the "power" connection that is adjacent to the Thermistor plug - both fan and thermistor connections are on the right hand edge of the board (looked at in the orientation where the majority of text labels on the board are upright). If you go back and review steps 75 - 78 carefully I think you will see how it's intended; they did not make a mistake in the instructions but maybe there is an opportunity there for better clarity. (The heater was plugged in much earlier).

The Extrusion is controlled by the Extruder motor. If it's pushing plastic down into the Hot End, then plastic is coming out of the nozzle. When the motor stops pushing, the flow of plastic from the nozzle slows down and then stops. In fact, the Extruder motor can even "retract" to pull some plastic filament back out of the Hot End in order to reduce or stop the ooze of residual plastic from coming out.
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
Have used many pounds of T-Glase filament. Now also doing some work with Ninjaflex SemiFlex
Print on glass with Scotch Craft Stick or other glue stick
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby donstauffer » 2013-Nov-Tue-10-Nov

Thanks, everyone, for the great help! I have the problem resolved and back to work on assembly.
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby gillmcil » 2015-Oct-Thu-10-Oct

RetireeJay wrote:OK, done.

But don't you have to be a Jedi knight and uber-geek guru to find all the software tools, special cables, and procedures to re-flash your software? I know when I read the threads about it I just get a headache... so many steps!!! (And I've been programming computers in Assembly, BASIC, Turbo Pascal, and Visual Basic since 1966; the problem is I kinda dropped out of that field in the last 10 years.)

(And if you can do re-flashing, why not fix the bug instead of implement a work-around?)


i use linux and it is very simple i just put the jumper on the board and send sudo dfu-programmer at90usb1286 flash {path to the hex file in the /tmp} and it works every time. i have not done this in windows but i hear that flip is even easier.

PS i would have put a link to flip but the forum wouldn't let me post an ofsite url and said it was spam
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2015-Oct-Thu-10-Oct

Yeah, some of that discussion way back when has become out of date. In fact, I have mastered re-flashing the firmware on my Printrbot, and even written up more than one guide on how to do it. (My hangup back in 2013 was not so much the physical process of doing the flashing, but rather the fact that the Marlin software is written in C++ and has dozens and dozens of files. Now I understand that almost everything that I might want to tweak is in Configuration.h and similar files.)

There are two ways of doing it (for Windows users) - either use the Arduino IDE and then FLIP, as I documented in the Wiki (the red-beige-and white button next to the "Search..." box at the top right of the Printrbottalk screen), OR use Notepad Plus Plus as your editor and PlatformIO as your compiler - then using FLIP to do the actual flashing. I actually prefer the latter because Notepad++ is so much better than the Arduino IDE. And you can easily link PlatformIO to a "Run" command within Notepad++, so the compilation process is only one or two clicks, just like in the Arduino IDE.

(But really, this discussion has drifted away from the OP topic: the hardware of the Printrboard. ;) )
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby Mooselake » 2015-Oct-Thu-20-Oct

I'm not trying to sound too harsh, but posting to 2 year old topics is called necroposting. It's a lot better to start a new topic rather than posting to an old one that's sort of related.

If you can start a new topic describing how to flash with Linux it would be useful; while the vast majority of our users use Windows (please skip the Linux is better at everything argument, been there, 30+ year *nix sysadm) we do have a select few that are Linux fans and would appreciate the information.

Thanks!

Kirk
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby plexus » 2015-Oct-Tue-16-Oct

Mooselake wrote:I'm not trying to sound too harsh, but posting to 2 year old topics is called necroposting. It's a lot better to start a new topic rather than posting to an old one that's sort of related.

If you can start a new topic describing how to flash with Linux it would be useful; while the vast majority of our users use Windows (please skip the Linux is better at everything argument, been there, 30+ year *nix sysadm) we do have a select few that are Linux fans and would appreciate the information.

Thanks!

Kirk


I disagree. If you have a post that is relevant to an older topic, then its preferable to post to the old topic than to create a new one - this consolidates knowledge into one place. following the "necroposting" logic would mean numerous posts all related to the same topic, making it harder to find what you want. What is the rationale that makes it "a lot better to start a new topic rather than posting to an old one that's sort of related'?
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby Mooselake » 2015-Oct-Tue-19-Oct

Linux firmware flashing techniques are not related to printrboard connectors or hardware assembly. It is, however, a useful subject that is, IMHO, worthy of being a separate new topic or a useful addition to a pertinent discussion.

This is, of course, only the humble opinion of a moose. The spamming hordes have given reviving several year old topics, even when the content is related, a bad name. They're probably the reason for the term necroposting, which I wasn't quick enough to invent. Some forums go as far as to lock topics after a while, although that's a bit extreme.

Kirk
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Re: Connectors on Printrboard

Postby RetireeJay » 2015-Oct-Tue-21-Oct

I agree with both of you. If someone was searching for content by the name of the OP, then they would never discover the software discussion in this thread. Hence, it's valid to suggest a new thread for Unix users. OTOH, I doubt anyone searches through the thousands of thread titles in this forum anymore. If it's not a "sticky" at the top of a topic area, it's probably not going to be found based on the OP title. We all use some kind of search engine. That's probably how gillmcill found this thread.

And I have seen spam "necroposting." But OTOH, sometimes a new user does discover an old thread that's very useful. For example, I sometimes refer people to the ancient thread "printing small." And if someone has something new to add to that, I'd say they are very welcome.

So basically, I wouldn't be too hard on reviving old threads, but I personally would encourage starting new topics if they are truly new. And there is a bit of a gray area when it comes to deciding "is this idea part of an existing thread, or is it a new idea"?
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Printrbot Plus operational January 2013
Brass threaded rods (5/16" X 18) & nuts for Z axis
GT2 belts & pulleys
Cable chain to reduce probability of fatigue failure in wires
E3D V5 Hot End, 0.4mm nozzle, also 0.8 and 0.25 in use occasionally
PB fan mount + 40mm fan -- using printed mount adapter, not the E3D supplied fan
Injection molded extruder gears
Optical Z "endstop" (custom designed and built)
Have used many pounds of T-Glase filament. Now also doing some work with Ninjaflex SemiFlex
Print on glass with Scotch Craft Stick or other glue stick
"My next printer is..." Prusa i3 MK3
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